Women's Money Wisdom

Episode 282: How to Face Your Finances and Build a Life That Works with Michelle Campbell

• Melissa Joy, CFP® • Season 4 • Episode 282

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What if your biggest financial setbacks were actually the foundation for your comeback?

Tax professional and financial literacy advocate Michelle Campbell joins Melissa Joy, CFP® for a powerful conversation on shame-free money management, taking control of your financial future, and rising from the ashes—literally.

Michelle shares her journey from five evictions and over $500K in debt to becoming an IRS-enrolled agent, nonprofit founder (Hashtag Stability), and author of the memoir Bluebird. With honesty and heart, she reveals how facing her numbers changed everything—and how she now helps others do the same.

Together, they unpack the emotional weight of debt, the myths that keep people stuck, and how understanding tax law can be a radical act of empowerment—especially for women and those overlooked by traditional financial systems.

This conversation is for anyone who’s ever felt behind, buried by shame, or unsure where to start. Spoiler alert: the first step is just looking.

💡 Key Themes Covered:

  • Getting honest: Why knowing your numbers is the first step to freedom
  • Breaking the silence around debt, shame, and financial trauma
  • The biggest myths about budgeting, credit, and investing (and what’s actually true)
  • What to know about debt collectors, credit reports, and disputing errors
  • Why tax literacy is a superpower—especially for business owners
  • How Michelle uses her story to educate and advocate through Hashtag Stability
  • Why success isn’t about having it all—it’s about understanding what you actually want


Connect with Michelle: 

ByMichelleCampbell.com

Facebook

https://www.instagram.com/bluebirdmemoir/

The previous presentation by PEARL PLANNING was intended for general information purposes only. No portion of the presentation serves as the receipt of, or as a substitute for, personalized investment advice from PEARL PLANNING or any other investment professional of your choosing. Different types of investments involve varying degrees of risk, and it should not be assumed that future performance of any specific investment or investment strategy, or any non-investment related or planning services, discussion or content, will be profitable, be suitable for your portfolio or individual situation, or prove successful. Neither PEARL PLANNING’s investment adviser registration status, nor any amount of prior experience or success, should be construed that a certain level of results or satisfaction will be achieved if PEARL PLANNING is engaged, or continues to be engaged, to provide investment advisory services. PEARL PLANNING is neither a law firm nor accounting firm, and no portion of its services should be construed as legal or accounting advice. No portion of the video content should be construed by a client or prospective client as a guarantee that he/she will experience a certain level of results if PEARL PLANNING is engaged, or continues to be engaged, to provide investment advisory services. A copy of PEARL PLANNING’s current written disclosure Brochure discussing our advisory services and fees is available upon request or at https:...

Speaker 1:

Welcome to the Women's Money Wisdom Podcast. I'm Melissa Joy, a certified financial planner and the founder of Pearl Planning. My goal is to help you streamline and organize your finances, navigate big money decisions with confidence and be strategic in order to grow your wealth. As a woman, you work hard for your money and I'm here to help you make the most of it. Now let's get into the show. Welcome back to the Women's Money Wisdom Podcast. Today, we're going to be talking about financial literacy, tax and just how you can take control of your life, and I have a wonderful tax professional, Michelle Campbell, here. She's also the founder of Hashtag Stability, which is a nonprofit that focuses on financial literacy, and she wrote an amazing memoir called Bluebird, which tells her own story of kind of picking herself up out of the ashes to, you know, kind of have a better financial life. Michelle, welcome to the podcast.

Speaker 2:

Thank you so much for having me. I am so excited. I love your platform. I listen to it too, and I just love that you also work in finance, like we have so much in common already.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, and I mean part of the mission of our show is to hear people, hear women talking about money matters. I think that we're giving people the language and the skills to decide confidently, to research for themselves, and one of your key passions and missions is financial literacy.

Speaker 3:

Can you tell?

Speaker 1:

me a little bit about why you care so much about people having that literacy and what part of you and your story is built into that passion.

Speaker 2:

So the passion is all built around my own personal story. My book Blooper talks about how I basically for lack of better terms went through hell and back. I experienced five evictions, four repossessions, three bankruptcies and I was half a million dollars in debt, total over a 21-year period, and so I was going through the ebbs and flows of life. That wasn't it wasn't like an ongoing struggle. You know, there were some times that I had plenty of money and I was paying my bills and my budget was working for me and I was trying to invest, and then there were times that I hit rock bottom and you know mixture of stupid mistakes and then not having that emergency fund, but it was the responses I guess I will say that I got that encouraged me to start Hashtag Stability.

Speaker 2:

There was a time that I was applying for health care benefits, you know, based on just my income and the app or the representative didn't even enter my application and just based off of how I looked and I guess I didn't look like I was in need. And then, when I was improved, they almost didn't want to help me because I did not fit this demographic of I didn't have any children, I wasn't a vet, I didn't have any disabilities, I didn't have any addictions and I was not social security age and I'm just thinking, I mean, what about everybody else? Because that affects a lot of us, and so the more that that kept playing and showing up in my life, I just swore that one day I was going to, once I was back on my feet, use the things that I know and that I've learned and use my personal experience to connect to the other people that I know have experienced or are experienced or will experience some of the same things that I have.

Speaker 1:

Well, that's so important because I know so many of us have stories from their past or their present that are limiting in terms of you know kind of how they feel their prospects are financially just difficult, and I'd love to hear you know kind of how they feel their prospects are financially just difficult. And I'd love to hear you know, as you work on financial literacy through hashtag stability, what are the lessons you learned on how to, you know, take control and make changes and and use resources and your own you know kind of sheer will to to find a way to have different outcomes.

Speaker 2:

Right. The first thing is there are so many misconceptions out there Like it drives me crazy. I call it knowing your numbers, but when I say that, I mean at any given point of the year. You need to know what your credit score is. You need to know how much interest you're paying on credit cards and on your mortgage. You need to know your numbers. You need to know what your credit score is. You need to know how much interest you're paying on credit cards and on your mortgage. You need to know your numbers. You need to know your numbers as far as your budget is associated with it, because you don't know what you can do until you know what you have, what your bottom line is and what is coming out, what's going in From there. I know a lot of people don't like budgets, but if you think about it.

Speaker 2:

It's the best of bad words, but I like to think about making a budget to almost benefit what I ultimately want to do. We all have bills and a mortgage or rent or car payments or utilities or groceries, whatever it is that you have to have to live. But what is it that you live for? And so if you focus on that and get rid of your bottom line, then you can see where you can invest and grow more money towards what you're living for, and I feel like that is a major key. Another misconception is you need a lot of money to start investing. You do not, and when we talk about investing, there's a misconception of it's hard or it's not for me, or you know that's not true. When I really learned investing, I felt so ashamed that I hadn't started sooner, because there are different types of investing that you can do and everything is not a risky investment, especially when we're talking about interest rates and high yield accounts and CDs right now. I mean that's a great way to invest and have guaranteed money and not lose it.

Speaker 1:

So that's kind of that's a great place to put your emergency reserves and that is, you know, kind of a starter kit, is getting that high yield savings account going and then participating in your retirement plan. And I hear in my own work so many people that have that similar shame. I think everybody else has it figured out. I don't know why I don't, but you know that's not necessarily the case because we don't get a starter kit, especially as women. You know, not everybody talks about money in their household or has money in their household. So then you know, some things that maybe pass along to others aren't passed along to you, but we really don't have that collective kind of cultural financial literacy that's, you know, evenly distributed across people.

Speaker 2:

So you're not alone if you're feeling that way, distributed across people, so you're not alone if you're feeling that way. Yeah, totally not alone, and it's okay. My very first step for myself was just being honest. I ran from the reality for so long Like I knew I had debt, but I didn't know how much, and that's part of that, knowing your numbers. And so once I started making that spreadsheet and writing down all the debt collectors and what the actual totals were, making phone calls, it actually wasn't as bad as what I thought.

Speaker 2:

I mean, granted, by the time I was able to do that, a lot of things had been written off as a bad debt which benefited me, and then they weren't being reported on my credit report and then things that were reported were inaccurate, which helped my score. So I mean that's why I made mean that moment of honesty. It's very scary. I'm making it sound like it's easier than what it is, but just to first be honest with yourself and face it and get rid of the shame and the guilt and the embarrassment and know your numbers, find out what those are first, I mean that's huge.

Speaker 1:

There's something so powerful about facing what you might consider to be failure and, you know, kind of acknowledging and then asking for help in some cases, you know, similar to the work that we do with people, or, you know, just making the time to listen to an episode like this. All of those are steps that are proactive, where you're focusing on what you can control and just acknowledgement is a step in terms of taking control versus just, you know, kind of running adding to your stress balls. You know that thought bubble of just like negative panic, what am I going to do? Taking action can be so powerful to you know, it's not just acknowledgement. That's the first step toward making changes.

Speaker 2:

For sure. I mean huge. So get rid of the fear, know your numbers and then after that, then you know what you're dealing with, what your bottom line is, how much you have to save. Which, to me, savings should be investing. No dollar should ever be sitting still making no money at all ever. I mean there's a way that it should. I mean, even if it's going to make a penny, it's making something. I mean, even if it's going to make a penny, it's making something. I have several, or had several clients at one time that had tons of money just sitting in a checking account so it wasn't even a savings account and I flipped. I'm like no wait, you can't you know and you're wondering why you're not making more, how to invest. I mean that's like kind of step number one, like just make sure that it's making money.

Speaker 2:

And there's so many of us out there right now willing to share, gracious, to share what we know and not gatekeeping it. And we do need that. Just women do? I feel like when I read tax code I don't know who wrote it, based on the language, but I mean when I'm thinking back to all the years that we've been working under it, I'm just like I mean, did they make it this complicated on purpose so that women would not understand, let alone majority of society not understand? I mean, it's just so. I'm happy to lend any information and experience that I have to the next person. I feel like that's how we all work together and we're all interconnected.

Speaker 2:

I've said before that the conversations that we should be having amongst friends and family are very personal. It's a full call to talk about money, but we should be saying so what's your credit score? And not embarrassed by it, because if someone has a better credit score, maybe they have some tips or tools to help you get there. Or maybe you both have horrible credit scores, and that's okay too, because that is not a forever. There are ways to get to raise your score. Let me say not get out of it To raise your score, to raise your score.

Speaker 1:

Let me say, not get out of it to raise your score Absolutely. And I think like having sometimes I refer to a financial accountability partner where you can have someone who's also either trying to work on their money or enjoys the money. If you both have lower credit scores, maybe you gamify it and you know, say who can find the best hack. But what are some of those hacks? If you're just sitting there with a credit score that you know doesn't reflect where you're going and doesn't allow you to kind of get by with the best, you know opportunities for borrowing or you know kind of credit, what do you suggest that people do?

Speaker 2:

Right, so first get the credit score and find out what's on there. Second dispute dispute dispute dispute I just had a conversation with a client the other day about all the inaccuracies that are probably there, even as small as you might not think that it's a big deal, but an address is a major inaccuracy. And then there are three major codes that protect us as consumers from the creditors. Because typically what happens is when a debt is so old like I experienced, some of mine were so old that I knew that they were probably written off as bad debts. Yes, that happens.

Speaker 2:

And then that company typically sells them to a third party who then, in turn, is trying to get the whole balance. But that's not what they bought it for. And so when they're saying, oh well, if you can pay today this $3,000 balance, if you can just pay $1,000 today, we'll call it even. They probably didn't even pay a thousand for it. They probably paid like in the hundreds for it. But if they can't back up the original creditor the amount, what it was when it was charged off, the contract basically.

Speaker 2:

Right, exactly, exactly, then you don't owe that by law. It's a law. You don't owe that, and so those are different things that you can get removed from your credit score to have it raised literally overnight. I've seen 24 and 48 hour improvement in scores, just with the inaccuracies.

Speaker 1:

Wow, that's really interesting. And for people that aren't, you know, kind of the roll up their sleeves and do it themselves people, I know like there is help out there, but also sometimes that help can come with more costs or less solutions. So how do you determine who or what to trust?

Speaker 2:

So I'm proud to say that all of our services are absolutely free. We do not gatekeep and the information is just there. There are different companies that will charge you something, but I don't think they're wrong either, because if I'm looking at, if we're facing, let's just say, $50,000 in debt and they're saying, okay, pay me $5,000 and I'll get this down to 10. So then combined, that would be 15. 15 is a whole lot cheaper than 50. Yeah, and if they can get it down or get it completely wiped out, then that's better for you too, because the longer that it sits there, if it still is active, it's doing nothing but gaining interest in penalties, which is digging you further in a hole, right?

Speaker 1:

Absolutely Well. Now the work that you do is both in some tax resolution right, but also accounting and mainly tax.

Speaker 1:

So tell me a little bit about how that integrates into your story. And you know, all of us, or almost all of us, pay taxes and tax code is not simple, and we've been talking about it recently since we have the new legislation policy bill that included new, a lot of new tax provisions. So tell me about your life today. You've built yourself up, You've risen from the ashes and let's talk a little bit about that tax side of your work.

Speaker 2:

Sure. So my tax journey started before I even really knew I was on a tax journey. I started my first business, which was in real estate development, when I was 21 years old, and so I did not have money to hire a me. I didn't have money to hire a CPA or a tax professional or a financial planner or a retirement specialist or anybody. And so I self-taught myself tax law, just so that I could file my business tax returns accurately. And from that then I learned. And I then later had a trucking company, which made it even more complex because there was fuel tax.

Speaker 2:

That IFTA was challenging. It was challenging, and so I didn't even realize that I had started a tax journey way back then that I would later be using. And so we fast forward, maybe like 15 years, and a friend suggests that just for extra money and because it might be fun that we go work in tax seasonally. And she was a teacher for advanced education in high school and I had gone to school for pre-med and engineering, and so I've taken like every math class known to man and you know, just kind of self-taught throughout the years on tax code. I thought you know, yeah, might be able to do that and so got certified, but then fell in love and then ended up getting credentialed with the IRS, which then put me in, or you know all the sanctions and everything that they might threaten you with, even if it's a that you didn't file argument because, you know we're hard on the IRS.

Speaker 2:

I actually have a lot of compassion for them and before I fully retire one day I mean that's years away, but I'm going to go and work at the IRS for at least a season because I want to know what they know. But I have a lot of compassion because all they're doing is enforcing the law that was given to them. They're not creating it or anything, and they are very, very willing to work with you. I've gotten so many cases that were supposed to be in court and got them just totally dismissed. Like you don't have to show up, you provided all the information that was needed. We don't see, you know, like you basically justified against us, and that's what we want. Justified against us, and that's what we want.

Speaker 2:

You know they're not really trying to lock you up or take your house or shut your bank account down, but I absolutely fell in love with tax code and then just kept taking that a step further. Then, once I finished with the enrolled agent credential, then went and started getting certifications in the accounting arena, then in the retirement arena, then in the investing arena, and I mean, as long as there's something out there for me to learn, that's what I want to do, because I want to be able to consult and look at everything in full scope, in a 360 degree, not just at the tax, you know, know the taxation on everything, but actually be knowledgeable in the other areas so that I can give you some input in the decisions that you're making elsewhere.

Speaker 1:

That makes so much sense and I am sitting in a similar you know kind of role. My number one job isn't to prepare taxes and I'm not in a similar you know kind of role. I my number one job isn't to prepare taxes and I'm not a tax planner. But there's so much tax implication in the work that we do and the decisions that we make in conjunction with clients on wealth management, and the more I know about taxes and the more I realize that there's so much impact you can have if you work with a financial planner who is tax aware and not every financial planner is allowed to be tax aware depending on the investment or brokerage firms they work on. Sometimes they just say we can't touch the tax topic at all, which is wild to me.

Speaker 1:

It's not the case for us, and then in other cases they just kind of operated in an old school world where you know your returns without consideration for taxes are more important than your after-tax returns, or you know kind of the big picture in terms of taxes. So I just could not agree more that you know tax touches so many aspects of your life and is so important in working with professionals that can be collaborative, whether it's your tax preparer or financial planner, or even you know your estate planner in some cases has tax implications in terms of the way assets are distributed and or in certain high, high net worth cases right now, estate tax, all of those, need you know, that tax hat on, and things are certainly not getting simpler, it's more and more complicated.

Speaker 1:

Things phase in, things phase out, all sorts of different thresholds for when things apply, and so the headlines don't always reflect exactly how you're going to be taxed, and that unfortunately, is job stability for us. I think simplification of tax would be nice, but it's not happening anytime soon, yeah.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, that reminds me of when tax cuts and jobs acts came out. And you would think I mean you know, according to the name of the tax law tax cuts and jobs acts that means that our taxes are going to be cut. There's going to be more jobs out there. This is going to be great for everybody. Myself, as a tax professional, very well vested at that point. It took me a whole year to understand what it actually meant and the impact that it would have on the majority of us. I still work with people that are absolutely clueless on exactly what happened.

Speaker 2:

But we never realized how important that personal exemption was. We didn't on the federal side, we didn't. And it changed tax as we know it, because we've never not had that, and I love that. I have several different decades of knowledge of tax law where I can say you know, back in 2000, we were doing this and then it changed to this and you know, but we've never not had a personal exemption. And that's just one example of I would talk to clients constantly and they just couldn't understand what was going on constantly and they just couldn't understand what was going on.

Speaker 2:

And you know this is somebody saying oh well, I've talked to a CPA or my investment person and they just told me, you know and nobody was explaining it to them how I did, and I mean it was extremely impactful. And when I started really digging into that particular tax law, it felt like the haves and the have-nots and I mean it just broke my heart. And so then what I started educating was let's use to our advantage what we have and instead of fighting against what we have, let's flow with what we can and use that part to our advantage. And it only works up to, of course, a certain income bracket or tax bracket, but still, I feel like that's kind of how we have to navigate these waters. Until things aren't so. It feels like the stock market in reverse or something.

Speaker 1:

I mean it feels very volatile on the different changes that are happening right now there are so many changes that have happened since the tax cuts and jobs act, which I think, if I remember correctly, was passed in 2017 and most of the changes came through in 2018. Um, there have been multiple pieces of legislation since then, some of them related to covid um legislation, like the cares act, plus some retirement related acts, including the secure act 1.0 and 2.0. We needed to add that one because then there was a two um inflation reduction act had certain things, and then the one big beautiful bill act I'm calling it ob3. I'm just like you know. Oh, you've already.

Speaker 1:

You've already renamed it well, it's just a lot to say and everybody has an opinion. So, um, anyway, I uh, I think that you know there is so much to keep track of and a lot of people they just, you know, fill out their tax returns and in the case I have a software that I can put in like the new bill versus what would have happened with the tax, like the current legislation or not the previous legislation, because, um, the one big beautiful bill is now current, um, and then you know some phases in in the future and things like that. It's complicated. Most people, or many people, will be just a few hundred dollar differential because the lower brackets, you know, have a slight tweak, but then you know there's big impact for certain people and then there's no impact for certain people too, if you're, you know, kind of in the higher bracket. So you know a lot to consider. But you need somebody that's going to stay current, because last year's law isn't always this year's law.

Speaker 1:

And it's even more complicated. Just as you were describing, Michelle, if you're a business owner, there is so much to keep track of. You're filing a business return and a personal return and all sorts of you know filing, deadlines, et cetera, so that is a lot where you, then the number of professionals that you need is likely growing.

Speaker 2:

Right. But you know, from my experience, when I started my first business, I did not have money to hire one professional, let alone three or four, to advise me. And I know that everybody is not going to be like me and you know, do it yourself. You know, go ahead and self-educate yourself. But there are people like me that are willing to help educate you because I mean it's my favorite topic and I am interested. I mean I'm going to be watching next year when things start rolling out like you know, almost like a year long Super Bowl or something like. I am so interested and because I like to let people know what's going to happen and get them prepared for it.

Speaker 2:

I always let people know that you have the power to change your results. You have the power to change your results Once we're talking, especially about tax and even investment, retirement. You have the power. It's not just what you get. So you decide what you want your result to be, whether it's how much money you need in your retirement fund or your risk tolerance on investing, or if you want a refund to break even or have a balance due. You have the power and you should be working with a professional that is telling you how to take hold of that power, because you can.

Speaker 2:

I that that is another misconception that people I think causes people to feel stuck more on where they're like well, I don't have any money to invest. Well, okay, I don't know who you've been talking to, but let's talk to somebody that tells you that you can start with $10 and show you how. Or I don't even know what I need to do for a retirement fund, or I haven't started, or it might not be enough for me. In addition to we don't, we still don't know what's going on with social security, do we?

Speaker 1:

We know the rules today, but they may change over time. But we don't know we ultimately don't know.

Speaker 2:

I mean, I don't know.

Speaker 1:

That's why it's so important to focus on what you can control. Right, like you can spend your whole entire day just thinking about the what ifs, but just, I think the thread that I hear from this discussion is be proactive about the things that you can control. Acknowledge, you know, when there's an elephant in the room that you haven't addressed, go ahead and start today. Um you don't.

Speaker 1:

I'm a huge fan of incrementalism, so you know everything doesn't get fixed with the magic wand. But being more engaged, more proactive, building, you know, both knowledge, as well as doing the right things, has a compounding impact in a positive way, in a way where ignoring, you know, shoving the, the notices under in the junk drawer, just has a negative compounding impact.

Speaker 1:

So I think that's the thing to remember if you're sitting in a situation where you want it to be better and you just wish you did have that magic wand. The magic wand really is your focus and what you can control, and building better results over time really is your focus and what you can control, and building better results over time.

Speaker 2:

Right, I wish that it was easier said than done to just get individuals to not focus on shame, embarrassment and being afraid. And you know, because once you can get over that, I feel like you receive more of what's out there and you're more willing to look for it, open to hearing it. And everybody doesn't like finance, everybody's not nerds like us Like that's okay, because like we're out there to do the work for you. You just have to reach out is the thing. You know. You're not going to get anywhere doing it by yourself and never calling anybody, but you just have to reach out. And there's so much information out there. I mean, that's one good thing about social media, that there's so much information out there. I mean, of course, everyone that you speak with needs to be vetted. I always refer people to irsgov because there is a registry on there of individuals that the IRS totally recommends that you talk to, and so it would be your fault if you didn't reach out to one of those people.

Speaker 1:

And you can't just believe in umbrellas, yeah, and similarly in our world you can look up any person who is registered as a broker or, in our case, we're an investment advisor representative.

Speaker 1:

I am registered with the SEC, you can look up any person, and you can also look up any past complaints or disclosures. Many people have clean records, but not everyone does, and so doing that lookup helps you to understand. You know the work history and the regulatory kind of record report card that they have, so similarly, you know asking the right questions. Understanding how you'll be compensating someone and then doing your research is really important.

Speaker 1:

I couldn't agree more, michelle. There's so much emotion tied with money and, if you can, I wish people knew that there's no tax bracket, there's no net worth where people don't feel that insecurity and shame when it comes to their financial knowledge, their financial knowledge. But the reality is, you know, most professionals aren't going to carry that shame in judgment of you. They really understand this is what they hear all the time too. And so, you know, don't let that be the impediment to scheduling the meeting or, you know, making the commitment to yourself.

Speaker 2:

Right. I mean definitely vet everybody and then everybody doesn't charge. Your prices are different. You mean definitely vet everybody and then everybody doesn't charge, or prices are different. You know, it's just that little bit of due diligence that I encourage everyone to do yeah and go ahead.

Speaker 1:

No, I was going to say utilizing nonprofits as well.

Speaker 3:

Right, if you're a business owner.

Speaker 1:

There's a lot of resources, either through small business administration or nonprofits that are built for entrepreneurs. Same goes for, you know, your organization, hashtag Stability. Also, there are nonprofits and local resources to assist on kind of building that gap for financial planning because unfortunately, you know, in the world of wealth management, wealth is a prerequisite but there are resources that can build financial literacy and be that bridge to get you to where you have more of those resources and assets to work long term with a professional, hourly engagements as well, can be really critical.

Speaker 2:

Right, but you got to start somewhere to build wealth. I mean, you can't.

Speaker 1:

Absolutely and you're just, you're exactly right. Like it's like the debt pay down and then have emergency reserves that are in interest bearing vehicles, because you know we went for so many years where the interest rates were like you know, point get a penny for every huge amount $100. So it's like that disincentivized people to educate themselves on interest, but now we're in a world where interest has returned and it really does make a difference whether you're you know kind of monitoring for the yield on your cash assets.

Speaker 2:

I love interest right now. Like I mean, it's not, it's not good if you have mortgage interest or property taxes.

Speaker 2:

But as far as making money off of interest, I mean I'm there and I hope that. I mean, like I said, go with the wave instead of fighting against it. Go with the wave instead of fighting against it. And so, where I hated when all of a sudden, this was like just a few months ago, when everybody was like pulling out of all of their investments in the stock market, I'm like no, because you know, leave those there.

Speaker 2:

But then there are companies that you know that they're going to bounce back. I mean you know they're just going off of the temperament of everybody and so, oh, everybody's worried and so our price is going to drop. But there are companies that are stable, reliable, they're going to be around forever. But that's an advantage because, ok, well, their price changed, their per share changed, and so now is the opportunity where you might not have been able to afford one share, let alone maybe like 10 or 20 or 100 shares at one time. And now you can because the price changed and you know that that company is a reliable company. And interest I am so excited about interest and dividends too. I think a lot of people sleep on dividends.

Speaker 1:

Well, yeah, we just lived through. The second quarter of 2025 was one of the biggest drawdowns and the quickest comebacks. All of it happened after, from you know, the second day of the quarter and had fully recovered by the end of the quarter, close to higher highs. So that's definitely made me live in interesting times. But if you are reactionary, it really it really can be problematic, um, having a process that you maintain discipline is so important. Well, michelle.

Speaker 1:

I love this discussion. How do we follow you, how do we find you? And um you know, also grab that book.

Speaker 2:

So the easiest way to find me is just my personal website, which is by michellecampbellcom, and that's B-Y Michelle, with two L's and then Campbell, spelled like the soupcom. Because on my site I list my financial services business, which is Tax Shell, I list the book Bluebird, I list my nonprofit Hashtag Stability and any other thing that I'm working on. I mean, even my dog has a business just for tax credits, love it. So any other thing that I'm working on. I love to share information. I don't gatekeep anything and I love to just inform and teach anything that I can. So I recently I guess not recently, but I started a blog in February and this is kind of a funny story, well, well, but then I forgot about it.

Speaker 2:

It happens, right, and so I just made the second post this week, actually, and it's talking about exactly what our conversation has been of life is going to keep lifing, and that doesn't mean to give up or to feel like you're alone and you're the only one going through it, but it's just my perspective and letting people know that, yes, I had this experience, I was able to bounce back, but that doesn't mean that the rest of my life I'm just going to skip off into the rainbow and everything's going to be okay. I mean, you're still going to have ebbs and flows in life, and I'm just really trying to be as transparent as possible to be relatable to individuals that may be experiencing or have experienced, some of the same things. So all of that would be on the buymichellecampbellcom website, and then from that website also, my socials are listed, and so, of course, I'm on Instagram and Facebook.

Speaker 1:

Well, michelle, keep building in, out, in the open, giving oxygen to your message, your story. I really appreciate the discussion and conversation and love the work you're doing. Thank you so much for joining us.

Speaker 2:

Thank you. Thank you so much for having me. This was so much fun.

Speaker 3:

Thank you for listening to the Women's Money Wisdom Podcast. If you found value in this episode, the best way that you can support the podcast is to forward an episode to a friend or leave a review. Go to proplancom and the podcast link to get all the resources and links mentioned. This presentation by Pro Planning is intended for general information purposes only. No portion of this presentation serves as a receipt of or a substitute for personal investment advice from Pearl Planning or any other investment professional of your choosing.

Speaker 3:

Copies of Pearl Planning's current rent and disclosure brochure and form CRS discussing our advisory services and fees are available upon request or on our website platform at pearlplancom. The information that we share is meant to educate and inspire, not serve as personalized financial advice. Everyone's situation is unique, so be sure to consult with your own financial professional for guidance that fits your life. And just so you know, the opinions shared in this podcast are Melissa's own and those of her guests. They don't necessarily represent any organizations with which Melissa is affiliated. For more important disclosures, please go to our webpage at proplancom.

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Melissa Joy, CFP

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